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Post by rockymountaineer on Jul 18, 2024 19:49:42 GMT
Harry Henning’s O-Gauge Tios & Tricks Facebook page has a post timestamped about an hour ago indicating an email correspondence with Ryan Kunkel this morning (Thursday) has announced an unforeseen delay — reportedly due to a decoration error on the C&O F-19 steamers. I don’t think this will affect the Christmas or Halloween models — only the C&O offerings.
Apparently, the deco error was discovered in Lionel’s NC warehouse. So the C&O models need to be returned to the overseas factory, as Lionel doesn’t have the staff in NC to handle the volume and extent of deco change required. No ETA was given for the corrected C&O models, but a round-trip via standard container shipping is roughly 12-14 weeks + factory time to make the necessary changes. So you can do the math from there.
Tough situation when these errors are discovered so late in the game. Lionel’s webstore is still showing a 7/19/2024 ship-date. But I’m sure that will be updated soon, as this news is just breaking as we speak.
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Post by runamuckchuck on Jul 18, 2024 20:36:22 GMT
Good grief! If correct not great news for any concerned except the buyer's wallet for awhile.
What exactly is a decoration error anyway?
In looking back at the catalog, it is hard to imagine that the lettering in the various iterations could be wrong requiring all of the C&Os to be sent back.
O&C?
Upside down GW or eagles?
Lettering or logos missing?
There is so little paint decoration on these engines it would be hard to imagine that being the problem unless all the C&O versions were painted for Christmas and or Halloween.
Hand applied attachments missing or upside down?
But the ugly head of cart before the horse QC takes another victim and as we have been discussing on another thread, this cannot help control the cost of these products.
There is no joy in Mudville; mighty Lenny the Lion has apparently struck out.
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Post by Adam on Jul 18, 2024 22:39:21 GMT
At least the error was found at the factory and not after they were delivered
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Post by steveoncattailcreek on Jul 18, 2024 23:36:51 GMT
At least the error was found at the factory and not after they were delivered Improvement-ish . . . ? 
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Post by rockymountaineer on Jul 18, 2024 23:56:05 GMT
At least the error was found at the factory and not after they were delivered I'm sure Lionel wishes the error would have been caught at "the factory", in which case that would have saved a premature trip from China to the US. As it stands now, these gems need to go back to China and then shipped to the U.S. again.
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Post by superwarp1 on Jul 19, 2024 13:58:48 GMT
And the errors keep on coming... The very reason why I think my MR. Muffins special Berk will be paint pink.  |
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Post by kanawha on Jul 19, 2024 14:08:20 GMT
I read somewhere (Mr. Muffin I think)that it was only the pre 1930's lettered C&O F19's. These had the road number on the tender coal bunker and a small C&O under the cab window. Instead the factory put the road number on the cab instead of the C&O. Seems like that would affect only one version of the vF19. Whether that affects release of the whole lot or there are other mistakes to be corrected who knows.
Ken
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jim
New Member
I am again reminded of my place and it not here.
Posts: 41
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Post by jim on Jul 19, 2024 17:07:50 GMT
I wonder if the cost of returning them, repairing them, shipping them back would come close to paying a company rep to look at them BEFORE they were shipped. That used be called QUALITY CONTROL.
Not mentioning the ill will with the buyers.............
Sure sounds like this bunch now at Lionel did not learn from past history. Anyone remember the move to Mexico?
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Post by superwarp1 on Jul 19, 2024 17:46:27 GMT
I wonder if the cost of returning them, repairing them, shipping them back would come close to paying a company rep to look at them BEFORE they were shipped. That used be called QUALITY CONTROL. Not mentioning the ill will with the buyers............. Sure sounds like this bunch now at Lionel did not learn from past history. Anyone remember the move to Mexico? Scott Mann of 3rdrail used to go to china and inspect every production run before covid. Don't know if he still does,and even with Scott inspecting everything things still slipped through. I know lionel gets a production sample before they ok the production run but anything can change during that run. From what I have been told Lionel's access to the factory is limited due to a hole bunch of reasons. That's why there's been a push over the last few years to move production out of that factory and out of china. The MTH tooling that Lionel purchased is still produced in the same factory MTH has been using for decades and the move to Vietnam for some of the rolling stock. Lionel even tried Europe many moons ago with the milk cars that the factory hijacked the tooling.
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Post by rockymountaineer on Jul 19, 2024 18:38:14 GMT
... Whether that affects release of the whole lot or there are other mistakes to be corrected who knows. ...
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Post by runamuckchuck on Jul 19, 2024 21:41:46 GMT
... Whether that affects release of the whole lot or there are other mistakes to be corrected who knows. ... This information is on a need to know basis requiring top security clearance. Access denied.
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jim
New Member
I am again reminded of my place and it not here.
Posts: 41
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Post by jim on Jul 20, 2024 12:56:47 GMT
Scott Mann of 3rdrail used to go to china and inspect every production run before covid. Don't know if he still does,and even with Scott inspecting everything things still slipped through. I know lionel gets a production sample before they ok the production run but anything can change during that run. From what I have been told Lionel's access to the factory is limited due to a hole bunch of reasons. That's why there's been a push over the last few years to move production out of that factory and out of china. The MTH tooling that Lionel purchased is still produced in the same factory MTH has been using for decades and the move to Vietnam for some of the rolling stock. Lionel even tried Europe many moons ago with the milk cars that the factory hijacked the tooling.
Why does that sound like the tail wagging the dog? Perhaps someone at Lionel should grow..........standup and say no more!
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Post by rockymountaineer on Jul 20, 2024 13:40:00 GMT
… Why does that sound like the tail wagging the dog? Perhaps someone at Lionel should grow..........standup and say no more!
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Post by runamuckchuck on Jul 20, 2024 16:15:50 GMT
Stop the world I want to get off!
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Post by rockymountaineer on Jul 21, 2024 13:36:50 GMT
Well… it appears the Lionel webstore has removed ETA shipping dates from the F-19 entries. And all of them now simply indicate “sold out”.
I pre-ordered the Christmas version. So if Lionel did indeed ship that model to dealers, we’ll know soon enough. This “deco error” thing has been a bit confusing. A Mr. Muffin’s email implies that the error could be limited to one model — one whose illustration shows #492 on both the tender AND underneath the cab window. “C&O“ should be underneath the cab window. So perhaps that’s the deco error. And only that model is being returned to the factory?
Not sure why that couldn’t have been stated more clearly. Then again… we are dealing with Lionel here. 
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