|
Post by dennisb on Jun 10, 2020 18:55:33 GMT
Typically, whenever this topic comes up on any 3 rail train forum, it’s time to get out the popcorn. And, perhaps, a few of you have raised eyebrows right now. So, I’ll get right to it–the answer to the question, “Are they toys or models?” is “Yes.” The hullabaloo arises because we have 2 distinct camps: those who wish to embrace the toy in the train and those who view themselves as model railroaders. However, one doesn’t have to preclude the other. In the early 1950’s, the magazine, Toy Trains, featured Lionel and American Flyer trains. Back then, there was no issue with that moniker. We knew what we had and it was certainly not the stuff that filled the pages of the scale magazines—Model Railroader and Railroad Model Craftsman. Still, we considered ourselves model railroaders. To that end, Lionel had put out a magazine from 1944 to 1949 called Model Builder. In 1950 Lionel published a book called, Model Railroading. Subsequent editions appeared through 1961. For many of us that book was the bible. As Joshua Lionel Cowen stated in the book’s Introduction, The fascination of model railroading—the urge to build and operate a miniature railroad system—is typically American. Each individual has the opportunity to inject his own personality into his work, to create a railroad system unlike any other in the world. So what happened? We grew up and so did our trains. Some of us are now creating the realistic empires that we used to dream about. Others are perfectly happy resurrecting the flat green tabletop. Many fall somewhere in between. Why does that matter? Model Railroading is a hobby and a hobby as defined by Merriam Webster is a pursuit outside one's regular occupation, engaged in especially for relaxation. The argument about toy trains verses models is silly. It seems to me that the labels are simply being used to justify one’s approach to the hobby. It’s a distinction without a difference.
|
|
|
Post by ptc on Jun 10, 2020 20:24:46 GMT
I like the popcorn to start this thread. I never quite understood how some folks who strive for the most realistic scenery and trains would from time to time look down on those who did not share their vision. Every style of layout is important to our hobby. We are so fortunate at the OGF as shortsighted upped-y folks who think they are better than anyone else in our hobby because others may model in a different style don't like to hang out here. All styles of layouts are welcomed and enjoyed for the creativity they represent. So, we enjoy our popcorn with pleasure and don't need Rolaids thereafter.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2020 20:25:14 GMT
So true Dennis. I wax nostalgic whenever I see a "Toy Train Layout" whether in photos or videos! I remember seeing my reflection in the glass and am amazed how wide my eyes were. The operating accessories spurred my imagination on and on! Jump ahead to today and my eyes are that wide again! When I see some of the totally incredible layouts that people have built, including our Member's layouts. WOW! A hobby is something to be enjoyed and I sure do enjoy this one. Thanks, Gary. p.s. I hope that popcorn is buttered!!
|
|
|
Post by josef on Jun 10, 2020 21:15:38 GMT
Toys or Models? Good post. When I was young, the toys of our childhoods, we looked at them as realistic from real or make believe world. The army men we had, or the then realistic Marx playsets. I remember my best friend had set up in his room a Marx western town with all the figures and pieces which were in playsets. Around the town and Fort Apache ran a Marx Old West train. With homemade mountains, Lichen etc. it was the real thing. A model of an old western scene. Today they were the toys of our childhood. My layout, I try to recapture a time. The autos and people that occupy the scenes are motionless. There are 3 rails which I hardly ever notice. Instead of controlling my engines from within the cabs, I have a hand controller in my hand, sometimes 2. To me they are representative of a real locomotive or rolling stock which I sometimes refer to as models. When visitors come over, many times my wife ask if they want to see my toy train layout. Toy or model, makes no difference nor does either one matter in the way its represented, its my Hobby, my enjoyment. Besides, the benefits of meeting and getting to know people of similiar enjoyment of trains and layouts are an added benefit. How others view their layouts and its contents matters little to me as long as they enjoy their layout. There's an old man in our neighborhood, Korean War Vet who has his childhood wind-up train set which he has set up on his coffee table and winds it up and runs it constantly and at Christmas time it goes under the tree. I'm sure he thinks of it more then as a toy.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2020 22:21:51 GMT
I recall, many years ago at a show. We had our Lionel modules, the 0 scale group had theirs (using my SC Hudson and 14 passenger cars). One of the guys on the 0 module was talking with me, looking wistfully over at the Lionel module (across the top of his scale NP Challenger) and voiced the opinion that he wished he had stayed in three rail....as they just flat had fun. They're all toys, unless you have non-running museum pieces.....has motor, gears, but won't go around anything less than a 40 foot radius...those are models.
|
|
|
Post by Adam on Jun 10, 2020 22:26:34 GMT
I couldn't agree more. I have as much enjoyment from observing toy train layouts as I do more realistic layouts. Both have something to offer and can be just as interesting in different ways.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2020 0:32:18 GMT
To me, they are all toys, even though some are very simple and others very sophisticated. When someone asks me if I have a hobby, I always respond with "I collect toy trains." Other than my newer, modern trains, my collection and layout are tinplate. I have a vanity license plate on my truck: TOY RR. I don't know if MODEL RR would have fit, but trying it never occurred to me.
|
|
|
Post by RLM on Jun 11, 2020 0:53:26 GMT
All this is 100% Perception.
There is not right or wrong because your hobby should please you only.
But, you have to be creative so your Empire is going to be peerless.
my 2 cents.
Andre.
|
|
|
Post by Country Joe on Jun 11, 2020 1:49:55 GMT
Dennis, in the third paragraph you ask, "So what happened?"
My answer is that back in the 1940s and 1950s anybody who had trains was a model railroader but somewhere along the line model railroading became divided into 3 camps. One was the serious model railroaders, or rivet counters, who obsessed over every detail. Another was the model railroaders who ran 2 rail trains but deviated from the prototype in various ways and thus failed to measure up to the "serious model railroader" standard in some way. The last group was the toy train guys which included those two railers who made little or no attempt to meet the "serious" standards and those who played with 3 rail and other toy trains. The three groups would be fine except that some in each group began to look down on those who belonged to another group.
I think we have the same 3 camps in our 3 rail O gauge hobby. We have 3 rail rivet counters, serious 3 rail model railroaders who strive for a certain level of prototype accuracy, model railroaders who make somewhat less of an attempt to follow a prototype, and some pure toy train guys. Like the bigger model railroading group above some in the O Gauge world look down on those who have a different way to enjoy the hobby.
Here at the OGF we consider all of these hobbyists model railroaders and we enjoy their various layouts and modeling skills. We have rivet counters and flat green tabletop train runners, a 2 rail scale guy, and even a couple of carpet central guys, but we value all of them, consider all to be model railroaders, and love to see what they are doing and how they are enjoying the hobby. So I don't think there will be very many raised eyebrows here. We are an inclusive group and value all our members regardless of their approach to the hobby.
So pass the popcorn, gimme a beer and let's run some trains.
|
|
|
Post by dennisb on Jun 11, 2020 12:52:35 GMT
Country Joe, I completely agree and I didn't really expect to see that issue here. Intelligent discussion and comradery are the hallmarks of this group!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2020 13:11:17 GMT
What I really like is looking at everybody's scenes on their layouts and seeing a moment frozen in time for all to enjoy. Some are generic and some are personal. All are pleasing to the eye.
Gary.
|
|
|
Post by Sir James on Jun 11, 2020 13:36:34 GMT
Fancy or plain, model RR or layout, they are still toys.
|
|
|
Post by laz57 on Jun 11, 2020 13:48:08 GMT
I totally agree with everything that was stated here. I enjoy looking at everyone elses contribution to the OGF Forum. It sometimes gets me to move on something I been putting off for sometime. Also it inspires me to do an add on to the layout that I have been pondering. We are all different and have different tastes of the things we enjoy seeing on our layout. Some whimsical some prototypical. Everyone has different opinions on what they like and to that there is no wrong. We all have one thing in common and that is these small toys or models are very cool and lets us get away from true reality even if it is for a very short hour or two a week. That being said, Run your trains and enjoy them today fore we know not what tomorrow will bring. Have fun GUYZ and ENJOY!!!!!!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2020 14:03:44 GMT
WELL SAID LAZMAN!! Gary.
|
|
|
Post by ptc on Jun 11, 2020 14:35:49 GMT
"In the early 1950’s, the magazine, Toy Trains"
Dennis, I loved this magazine. I remember it well.
|
|