|
|
Post by chipset35 on Oct 6, 2024 13:16:31 GMT
Yesterday while testing my layout under command and control yet again; I became frustrated, as again I was plagued by DCS issues. "RF Out of range" for only one locomotive, a diesel always starting on power up instead of when I press start up, and then ignoring all commands until I shut it down and restart up it. Also, a GG-1 with poor pulling power and issues below 10 on the speed setting (not smooth until after 10 to 15).
Then there were mysterious shorts triggering the fuse on my MTH power bricks.
This is when I tested both my tried and true faithful and reliable MTH NYCHRR 4-4-0's. Unfortunately, these had issues too, on parts of tracks the Rail Kings did not. I had at 7 power connections spread out along the layout with MTH Lock-Ons and RealTrax.
Fed up I put all my DCS and PS2, 3 trains away, broke out the conventional transformers and started testing with a Williams E Series Diesel set. Poof! All issues gone!
Now I do not blame MTH, as my 2 TIU's are OLD, both from early 2000's, as well as half the track and most of the motive power. Yet, they do not have a lot of run time since I spent 75% of my time since 2006 tearing down and rebuilding my layout.
Last night I started placing additional Williams motive power on the layout and eventually some Lionel PWC and Conventional Classics. This layout had a complex 2 connected loop track plan, but I removed the interconnection to simplify it and allow one loop for conventional and the other for TMCC PWC. If the PWC TMCC gives me fits, I will just run them in conventional too.
The first thing I noticed was how easy it was to run trains. Make sure everything is plugged in, press the on button for the power strip and move the throttle. Done! Whereas with DCS I was constantly, having to press and wait for start up, then use the thumb wheel, more buttons for this and that. I was spending 90% of my time staring at an LCD instead of the trains. Now with conventional, I spend 95% of my time watching trains and sometimes adjusting the throttle on the transformers. Easy peasy. In addition, I think subconsciously I was looking for an excuse to go back to conventional as a pleasant throwback to my childhood, as I noticed while reading thru my 2 train magazines (Classic Toy Trains and OGR), it was the conventional and especially post war trains that got me excited. Williams, Lionel PWC, post war vintage and CC's, along with MTH old PS1 in conventional mode. I do not miss the cab chatter, as I always felt both Lionel and MTH cab chatter was annoying and sounded cheesy sometimes. Also, all the sounds from several engines and having to always adjust the volume down was just too noisy for me.
Now don't get me wrong, I love MTH DCS and Lionel Legacy and TMCC. But I think I became burnt out on them. For now I am running trains more and troubleshooting less, and having more fun.
|
|
|
|
Post by redjimmy1955 on Oct 6, 2024 16:00:09 GMT
Chipset...kudos to you! You say you have RealTrax..I don't like that stuff. Unfortunately I have plenty invested in it.
Me thinks some or most of your electrical problems are with RealTrax...JUNK..JUNK..
JUNK!
YEAH...then to get a multimeter out to test here and there...whew, that's NOT running trains! Been there, done that quite often on my previous Carpet Centrals!
Good luck, I mean it, on fixing electrical gremlins!!
|
|
|
|
Post by david1 on Oct 6, 2024 20:49:23 GMT
Running conventional does have its perks but I have run command since 1995 especially with Tmcc that I really would miss it if I ever went back to conventional.
I have run dcs for quite sometime though not anymore and yes it did have its quirks and it was a pita sometimes and but I would use it again if I had more dcs engines. Right now I run my dcs engines in conventional with my transformer.
Dave
|
|
|
|
Post by chipset35 on Oct 7, 2024 10:37:53 GMT
In addition to running my Williams E Diesels, I also ran a Williams B&O with RMT passenger cars. Also, Lionels PWC Southern and Texas Special F3's.
I didnt think the PWCs ran as good as the Williams. Maybe its the huge power draw of the Pullmor motors? I added more power lockons.
In addition,, I added a 4 track yard for visible staging.
Construction photos coming soon!
|
|
|
|
Post by seayakbill on Oct 7, 2024 12:38:11 GMT
I have one main line of the three on the layout that is basically reserved for conventional operation. I can run command locos on it since it is powered via the MTH TIU/variable channel but typically the conventional locos call this mainline home. Especially good for Lionel Postwar locos with mechanical e-units that are known to unexpectedly cycle to neutral.
|
|
|
|
Post by chipset35 on Oct 7, 2024 13:18:57 GMT
Been using MTH Z-1000 Bricks and transformers.
Trying to avoid both DCS and Leagacy/TMCC handhelds.
Much of my angst with those 2 handhelds in addition to what I already mentioned is my hands and fingers always ache from arthritis, carpal (wrist), and corporal (arm) tunnel.
The cycling is annoying, I notice some can be locked in forward to avoid cycling.
|
|
|
|
Post by Adam on Oct 7, 2024 14:03:12 GMT
Good for you. I have been toying on and off with the idea of doing the same. Less expensive, less stressful, more time running trains and (in my opinion) more fun.
If I were to do it, I would actually offload most of my command control trains and equipment. Yes, they can run conventional as well, but my goal would be to simplify my train experience across the board. I would keep a handful that are special to me, but most modern would go. A conventional engine breaks, I fix it, a command control engine breaks I probably need to pay someone or spend a ton of money to get new electronics, etc. Takes the fun out of it.
A huge added bonus for me is that I would focus mostly on older conventional only engines (post war Lionel, MPC, Williams, I love these trains). Fixing, maintaining, repainting and resurrecting older engines is something that I love to do, so that would be a bonus. I love hunting for post-war engines, and there is a ton of it out there for little to no money.
I am seriously considering this change in direction. I will very likely do it at some point.
|
|
oace
Full Member
Posts: 241
|
Post by oace on Oct 7, 2024 15:22:24 GMT
Hi chipset35 ! To be honest, I never went the digital way... Like you, I prefer the simplicity of a train running on a large oval track, using a basic (DIY) transformer :  The garden way - temporary :   THe Carpet Central way (as named by healey36 ) - also temporary :   But I am completely puzzled when it comes about the compatibility of recent / modern US locomotives with the classic transformer control system à la Lionel prewar / postwar. I mean, for example, these models, among others : Williams 40298 New York Central Scale Hudson #773 12 wheel tender NIB www.ebay.fr/itm/184892644486Lionel 6-18005 O NYC 4-6-4 700E Hudson Steam & Tender #5340 w/ Display Case LN www.ebay.fr/itm/296579714375MTH Rail King Union Pacific 4-6-2 Forty Niner Steam Locomotive w/ PS1 30-1139-1 www.ebay.fr/itm/196466039482MTH 30-1113L O Gauge NYC 4-6-4 Dreyfuss Hudson Steam Loco & Tender #5445 w/PS1 www.ebay.fr/itm/335462784706MTH 30-1127-1 O Gauge MILW 4-6-4 Hiawatha Steam Loco & Tender w/PS1 #100 LN/BOX www.ebay.fr/itm/335577951688How can I identify those who will work and not work ? I'm really not familiar with all those new functionalities...  OACE |
|
|
|
Post by Country Joe on Oct 7, 2024 16:08:01 GMT
If I magically got the space for O I would go conventional with post-war Lionel and MPC. The 3 rail scale bug never bit me so I have no interest in that stuff. I would run traditional steam engines and rolling stock. While not scale they are proportioned so they look good together. Of course, there is almost no chance of my ever having more room so this is just dreaming for me.
|
|
|
|
Post by Adam on Oct 7, 2024 16:14:47 GMT
The only real challenge for me is the logistics and work to sell off the items I no longer want. That will be a hassle.
The idea of going back to the trains of old, the ones I dreamt of as a kid, is very appealing to me. Such a simpler approach to the hobby.
|
|
|
|
Post by atsda on Oct 7, 2024 16:20:37 GMT
chipset35, I am glad to know that you are having fun running conventional. There is something to say about the 'plug and play' aspect of conventional. It's now time to bring out the 2343 and 2353 for some long consists. Alfred
|
|
|
|
Post by Country Joe on Oct 7, 2024 16:24:47 GMT
I feel the same, Adam. I thoroughly enjoyed the modern trains I had and never had problems with DCS but modern trains don’t have the magic of the post-war and MPC era trains for me.
|
|
|
|
Post by af3020 on Oct 7, 2024 20:21:39 GMT
Yup, me too. Conventional is definitely the way to go.  |
|
|
|
Post by steveoncattailcreek on Oct 7, 2024 22:24:11 GMT
Yup, me too. Conventional is definitely the way to go. Yeah, ditto here as well. Almost all PW Marx, with a few exceptions, and everything under conventional control. 
|
|
|
|
Post by healey36 on Oct 7, 2024 22:53:03 GMT
The idea of going back to the trains of old, the ones I dreamt of as a kid, is very appealing to me. Such a simpler approach to the hobby. We'll make a "looper" out of you yet, Adam... 
|
|
