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Post by rockymountaineer on Jan 18, 2023 15:52:55 GMT
... The bottom line is there are ways to buy any trains from any manufacture that you want with just with a little planning on your part. If you don't want the train then don't buy it, but please don't use price as a justification as to why you are not buying when in reality you probably never wanted that particular train in the first place. Importers love this line of thinking. Be honest with yourself. This is like walking into a car dealership and hearing the salesperson ask you what kind of monthly payment can you afford. 9 times out of 10, this leads to the unsuspecting buyer spending more than they should for a car purchase. It's the oldest sales tactic around.
Also... please don't presume you know that somebody wasn't interested in buying something in the first place. You'd be quite surprised at what goes on behind the eyes of O-Gauge enthusiasts.
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Post by MichRR714 on Jan 18, 2023 16:29:22 GMT
I don't think there is any question that on the vast majority of product that Lionel is priced higher than MTH. Just take the Detroit Terminal Railroad NW2 announced in the last catalog and the special run of the same locomotive previously announced by Pat's trains as an example.
However I agree people should buy what they want from both manufacturers. That's how you fill out your roster with the pieces that are meaningful to your railroad.
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Post by david1 on Jan 18, 2023 19:37:10 GMT
I did my own comparison. I ordered a Custom MTH Premier Central Maine & Quebec AC-4400 Cab # 1002 from EZ Catch Train Shop: $569.99 Last month I received from Mr. Muffins Trains a Lionel Legacy SD90MAC Diesel Locomotive "Canadian Pacific" Veterans #7023 and it's sibling #7022 for $584.99 each. I ordered all three locomotives because I like the road names and I like how they looked. The Lionel locomotives are a whole $15 more than the MTH locomotive. IMO, $15 is insignificant. This whole trope and mythology that "Lionel is killing the hobby with their prices" that haunts O Gauge forums twice a year when the Lionel catalog comes out is about twenty years past its shelve life. Buy the trains you want from the manufacture that makes them. If it is expensive, then save up for it. You have the time to do so between when the product is announced and when it is delivered. Some train shops will allow you to put a train on "lay-a-buy" so you can pay for the train in easy installments and have it paid off long before it is delivered. That is how I purchased the Canadian Pacific" Veterans #7023 and its sibling #7022 from Mr. Muffins. I paid them both off in easy installments and didn't worry about it. When they came in I had two fun locomotives to run with no shock to the wallet. The bottom line is there are ways to buy any trains from any manufacture that you want with just with a little planning on your part. If you don't want the train then don't buy it, but please don't use price as a justification as to why you are not buying when in reality you probably never wanted that particular train in the first place. Your so wrong, I refuse to buy from any mfg that I think is over pricing their product be it cars or trains. Saying I didn't want a train anyway has nothing to do with it. There are lots of trains in the new catalog that I would love to have. But the prices are beyond what I am comfortable with. I always shop for the best price that is in my comfort zone. Right now its in the secondary mkt. If you want to buy the new items in the catalog than by all means do it but don't presume I will and what my reason was. Dave
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Post by madockawando on Jan 18, 2023 20:19:36 GMT
... The bottom line is there are ways to buy any trains from any manufacture that you want with just with a little planning on your part. If you don't want the train then don't buy it, but please don't use price as a justification as to why you are not buying when in reality you probably never wanted that particular train in the first place. Importers love this line of thinking. Be honest with yourself. This is like walking into a car dealership and hearing the salesperson ask you what kind of monthly payment can you afford. 9 times out of 10, this leads to the unsuspecting buyer spending more than they should for a car purchase. It's the oldest sales tactic around.
Also... please don't presume you know that somebody wasn't interested in buying something in the first place. You'd be quite surprised at what goes on behind the eyes of O-Gauge enthusiasts. Buying car is not even in the same ball park as buying trains. Most people need a car, no one needs toy trains. If you want to propose that Lionel is wildly more expensive for similar products, then please post some examples. Otherwise, buy what trains you like and if you want it, save your money or put it on lay a way. You can buy any train you want, just plan ahead. Meanwhile, Lionel keeps chugging along just fine. Just one other thing: " please don't presume you know that somebody wasn't interested in buying something in the first place." If someone doesn't want a train in the catalog for any price then what is the point of complaining about how high the price is, except to be a complaining curmudgeon.
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Post by madockawando on Jan 18, 2023 20:43:25 GMT
Here is another comparison catalog price vs catalog price. MTH RailKing AS-616 Diesel Engine With Proto-Sound 3.0: $369.95 www.mthtrains.com/30-20885-1 From the Lionel 2023 catalog CANADIAN NATIONAL LIONCHIEF PLUS 2.0 ET44AC #3810: $399.99 www.lionelstore.com/Canadian-National-LionChief-Plus-2.0-ET44ac-3810Price difference: $30.04!! No big deal. Between these two locomotives My buying decision will be based on the road name and locomotive model I am interested. Otherwise, a $30 price difference isn't going to get me to choose one over the other.
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Post by MichRR714 on Jan 18, 2023 20:46:07 GMT
Here is another comparison catalog price vs catalog price. MTH RailKing AS-616 Diesel Engine With Proto-Sound 3.0: $369.95 www.mthtrains.com/30-20885-1 From the Lionel 2023 catalog CANADIAN NATIONAL LIONCHIEF PLUS 2.0 ET44AC #3810: $399.99 www.lionelstore.com/Canadian-National-LionChief-Plus-2.0-ET44ac-3810Price difference: $30.04!! No big deal. Between these two locomotives My buying decision will be based on the road name and locomotive model I am interested. Otherwise, a $30 price difference isn't going to get me to choose one over the other. Since the MTH engine is a scale model and the Lionel engine is not sure seems like the MTH engine is a much greater value.
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Post by Traindiesel! on Jan 19, 2023 0:18:42 GMT
I was going to make some chocolate chip cookies, so I have a dozen eggs I’ll trade for the Vision Line Big Boy!!
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Post by madockawando on Jan 19, 2023 2:28:44 GMT
Here is another comparison catalog price vs catalog price. MTH RailKing AS-616 Diesel Engine With Proto-Sound 3.0: $369.95 www.mthtrains.com/30-20885-1 From the Lionel 2023 catalog CANADIAN NATIONAL LIONCHIEF PLUS 2.0 ET44AC #3810: $399.99 www.lionelstore.com/Canadian-National-LionChief-Plus-2.0-ET44ac-3810Price difference: $30.04!! No big deal. Between these two locomotives My buying decision will be based on the road name and locomotive model I am interested. Otherwise, a $30 price difference isn't going to get me to choose one over the other. Since the MTH engine is a scale model and the Lionel engine is not sure seems like the MTH engine is a much greater value. WRONG!!! Both of the locomotives I used in the comparison are semi scale locomotives. If the MTH was scale it would be premier.
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Post by MichRR714 on Jan 19, 2023 3:03:10 GMT
Since the MTH engine is a scale model and the Lionel engine is not sure seems like the MTH engine is a much greater value. WRONG!!! Both of the locomotives I used in the comparison are semi scale locomotives. If the MTH was scale it would be premier. Nope. I'm not wrong but you are. Apparently your not all that familiar with the MTH product line or the RailKing Scale products. Many RailKing items are 1:48 Scale proportions.
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Post by Traindiesel! on Jan 19, 2023 3:53:13 GMT
Ok, how about TWO dozen eggs and a roll of toilet paper!!
For just one measly Big Boy!
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Post by madockawando on Jan 19, 2023 11:51:53 GMT
WRONG!!! Both of the locomotives I used in the comparison are semi scale locomotives. If the MTH was scale it would be premier. Nope. I'm not wrong but you are. Apparently your not all that familiar with the MTH product line or the RailKing Scale products. Many RailKing items are 1:48 Scale proportions.
Railking does not equal premier. And just because it is listed as 1:48 doesn’t make it a Premier product for the sake of a comparison. I can use a Lionel Lionchief GP9 for the comparison if you want. That is also 1:48 proportion. Railking and Lionel Lionchief plus are comparable products to use in a price comparison. My point is made. So far, I have two posted factual comparisons between comparable MTH and Lionel products: Lionel Legacy to MTH Premier locomotives and a Lionel Lionchief locomotive to a Railking locomotive. There is no significant difference in price. This whole hysteria that we are subjected to twice a year about Lionel’s high prices every time a new catalog drops are just that: hysteria and excuse making.
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Post by josef on Jan 19, 2023 12:21:08 GMT
I was going to make some chocolate chip cookies, so I have a dozen eggs I’ll trade for the Vision Line Big Boy!! Have you priced the cost of a head of lettuce recently?
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Post by madockawando on Jan 19, 2023 13:12:35 GMT
I did my own comparison. I ordered a Custom MTH Premier Central Maine & Quebec AC-4400 Cab # 1002 from EZ Catch Train Shop: $569.99 Last month I received from Mr. Muffins Trains a Lionel Legacy SD90MAC Diesel Locomotive "Canadian Pacific" Veterans #7023 and it's sibling #7022 for $584.99 each. I ordered all three locomotives because I like the road names and I like how they looked. The Lionel locomotives are a whole $15 more than the MTH locomotive. IMO, $15 is insignificant. This whole trope and mythology that "Lionel is killing the hobby with their prices" that haunts O Gauge forums twice a year when the Lionel catalog comes out is about twenty years past its shelve life. Buy the trains you want from the manufacture that makes them. If it is expensive, then save up for it. You have the time to do so between when the product is announced and when it is delivered. Some train shops will allow you to put a train on "lay-a-buy" so you can pay for the train in easy installments and have it paid off long before it is delivered. That is how I purchased the Canadian Pacific" Veterans #7023 and its sibling #7022 from Mr. Muffins. I paid them both off in easy installments and didn't worry about it. When they came in I had two fun locomotives to run with no shock to the wallet. The bottom line is there are ways to buy any trains from any manufacture that you want with just with a little planning on your part. If you don't want the train then don't buy it, but please don't use price as a justification as to why you are not buying when in reality you probably never wanted that particular train in the first place. Your so wrong, I refuse to buy from any mfg that I think is over pricing their product be it cars or trains. Saying I didn't want a train anyway has nothing to do with it. There are lots of trains in the new catalog that I would love to have. But the prices are beyond what I am comfortable with. I always shop for the best price that is in my comfort zone. Right now its in the secondary mkt. If you want to buy the new items in the catalog than by all means do it but don't presume I will and what my reason was. Dave Hi Dave, Can you help me understand where you are coming from? You said that "There are lots of trains in the new catalog that I would love to have. But the prices are beyond what I am comfortable with." I'm curious about what trains from the new Lionel catalog that you would like to buy but you feel are priced too high for you to buy. Most importantly, what price would you be comfortable buying them?
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Post by rockymountaineer on Jan 19, 2023 15:08:19 GMT
Importers love this line of thinking. Be honest with yourself. This is like walking into a car dealership and hearing the salesperson ask you what kind of monthly payment can you afford. 9 times out of 10, this leads to the unsuspecting buyer spending more than they should for a car purchase. It's the oldest sales tactic around.
Also... please don't presume you know that somebody wasn't interested in buying something in the first place. You'd be quite surprised at what goes on behind the eyes of O-Gauge enthusiasts. Buying car is not even in the same ball park as buying trains. Most people need a car, no one needs toy trains. If you want to propose that Lionel is wildly more expensive for similar products, then please post some examples. .... Obviously you've missed the point of my post about monthly payments entirely. And let's just leave it at that.
As for comparing mode train products, I've recently posted some very key points of comparison -- particularly of products AFTER Lionel purchased MTH tooling and is now offering those same products under the Big L brand at substantially higher prices. That's your homework to review those posts.
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Post by curtis on Jan 19, 2023 16:00:17 GMT
Okay let me get this straight. At this point we are at two dozen eggs, a roll of toilet paper and a head of lettuce. As soon as it includes paper towels I am in! O f course a 7Up would really clinch it!
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