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Post by rockymountaineer on Oct 6, 2024 22:46:22 GMT
With price points being what they are these days, I thought a view observations are worth noting:
(1) It wasn't THAT long ago, that I can remember Lionel was happy to offer "A" Vision Line locomotive every other year. And aside from a pilot model or an extra road number, the features stood out to call enthusiasts to buy ONE model. Then several years ago, one of the Big Book catalogs had about a dozen pages of Vision Line offerings. I'm referring to the catalog that contained the Vision Stock Express train set: a "reasonably sized" train set led by a Vision Line GS-4 steamer along with less than half a dozen pieces of rolling stock... including Vision Line sound cars and a Cupola-cam caboose. Catalog'd for $2,499 MSRP. Nice set!!!
Then Lionel morphed the basic Vision "set" into what they now call "Super Sets", including the Vision Line locomotive of that year plus a dozen or so pieces of O-scale rolling stock.
Aside from Vision "super sets", Lionel has also morphed its strategy to produce MULTIPLE Vision models / SKU's of it's big-ticket Vision Line locomotives -- largely as different roadnames and roadnumbers. An interesting strategy to say the least that seems to be working.
(2) I'm curious how most folks are "funding" the Vision Line purchases at these prices. I have on occasion been thinning out my collection at Allentown ATMA for a few years now. And that certainly helps grow the piggy bank funds for new purchases. Every little penny helps. And I'd bet Lionel figures a growing number of enthusiasts must be doing this to ease the pain of net-new-cash out of pocket when paying for new Vision Line goodies.
Regardless of these observations... I will say that I do enjoy Lionel's Vision Line offerings. In addition to cool, top-notch features... the roadname/roadnumber-specific dialogues add a unique sense of enjoyment to running different trains. Otherwise the dialogs can get old-and-tired rather quickly. For that reason alone, my preference is to purchase a Vision Line offering... even if there's a slight price premium to be had. The StationSounds dining cars are another way to create roadname-specific dialogs that add a nice fun-factor to watching and listening to the trains roll.
Although premium priced, the Lionel Vision Line offerings seem "competitive" in certain cases. For example, Trainworld sponsored a custom-run MTH NYC Pacemaker Hudson about a year ago (give or take). I think the announced priced was $1,699 MSRP for pre-orders. But shortly after they were delivered, as inventory became more limited... the price jumped to $2K. (The Trainworld site shows ONE remaining for sale.)
But now we can pre-order a Lionel Vision Line NYC Pacemaker Hudson with all of Lionel's Vision features, roadname-specific dialogs as well as top-notch Legacy Railsounds for a penny under $1,500. Although that's still a lot of money by anyone's standards, it's also a great deal given the alternative paying secondary market prices or "last one" prices just to have it NOW vs. some point next year.
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Post by david1 on Oct 7, 2024 7:03:48 GMT
Just talking to a friend of mine who was complaining about the new hudson announcement because his vision line hudson that was made a few years ago is that his is now losing value. I told him I don't care. Stop buying these locomotives just to resell when the prices go up.
Buy them to enjoy, buy them to run.
If you want to make money, invest in the mkt,buy gold, buy silver but stop complaining to me about your toys not holding their value.
Btw I have heard the same comment from several other guys who buy these over priced wonders but never run them.
Dave
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Post by madockawando on Oct 7, 2024 12:57:12 GMT
Just talking to a friend of mine who was complaining about the new hudson announcement because his vision line hudson that was made a few years ago is that his is now losing value. I told him I don't care. Stop buying these locomotives just to resell when the prices go up. Buy them to enjoy, buy them to run. If you want to make money, invest in the mkt,buy gold, buy silver but stop complaining to me about your toys not holding their value. Btw I have heard the same comment from several other guys who buy these over priced wonders but never run them. Dave I looked up on eBay "Lionel hudson" and its true that some hudsons have decreased in value while others on eBay have an asking price that is above the original MSRP. However, modern hudson that has tanked in value the most is the Century Club 773. It lacks detail and its pulmore motor made it a rough and noisy runner. I have seen these offered on eBay for half of the original catalog price. In fact, all of the original Century Club items are selling at a fraction of their original MSRP. Whoa be to speculators who bought two of everything to stash away and sell at a profit a few years down the road. However, the market is not yet saturated with these full scale beasts and as Mountaineer has pointed out, Lionel is offering more and more Vision Line locomotives with each successive catalog. So someone is buying them. I am interested, but I am waiting to see what Stu and METCA come up with before I make a decision.
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Post by MartyE on Oct 7, 2024 13:26:27 GMT
As much as I would like one, I have too many pending arrivals and orders. My plan is to wait until they are delivered and see where I stand with the other purchases.
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Post by redjimmy1955 on Oct 7, 2024 13:40:45 GMT
The word is PRICE...not necessary to include the word "point".
Boy does proper English take a beating!
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Post by madockawando on Oct 7, 2024 13:50:00 GMT
As much as I would like one, I have too many pending arrivals and orders. My plan is to wait until they are delivered and see where I stand with the other purchases. I am sure that you are not the only one. I have on order from Lionel multiple engines and sets.
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Post by rockymountaineer on Oct 7, 2024 14:46:04 GMT
The word is PRICE...not necessary to include the word "point". Boy does proper English take a beating! As do manners on social media platforms. If you don’t like someone, that’s fine. But it’s not necessary to show it at every opportunity. Have a great day, sir. |
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Post by Country Joe on Oct 7, 2024 16:15:54 GMT
The word is PRICE...not necessary to include the word "point". Boy does proper English take a beating! As do manners on social media platforms. If you don’t like someone, that’s fine. But it’s not necessary to show it at every opportunity. Have a great day, sir.
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Post by madockawando on Oct 8, 2024 1:41:33 GMT
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Post by rockymountaineer on Oct 8, 2024 2:38:35 GMT
Yes... this is the one I mentioned earlier in the thread.
I actually like the appearance of MTH's Pacemaker colors over the ones Lionel used in their Mohawk a couple of years ago. It just had a richer look to it. The MTH NYC Pacemaker red is deeper, and the smokebox color is a shimmering silver vs. Lionel's oh so chalky-looking, primer gray that I can't imagine WHY Lionel tolerated that coming out of their factory for so many years.
So the question remains... and we likely won't know the answer until these Vision Hudson arrive this time next year... Will Lionel rest on its laurels, and produce a NYC Pacemaker in the exact same paint scheme as the Mohawk? Or will Lionel up the ante for its 125th Anniversary, and produce a truly magnificent, "must have" model for collectors AND operators?
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Post by madockawando on Oct 8, 2024 17:07:55 GMT
Anyone know what happened to METCA and their uncatalogued Vision Line Hudson? I thought it would have been announced by now.
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Post by superwarp1 on Oct 8, 2024 17:26:45 GMT
Model train stuff. Remember them? In their new incarnation, they want a 10% deposite down to order one.  I think they want full retail for it as well.  |
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Post by bobthetrainguy on Oct 13, 2024 16:40:32 GMT
I really don't understand why that paint job is $600 extra.
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Post by rockymountaineer on Oct 13, 2024 18:13:32 GMT
I really don't understand why that paint job is $600 extra.
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I think they want full retail for it as well. 
