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Post by vintagemodeltrainguy on Jul 31, 2024 14:26:55 GMT
We found this little Marx Tin Litho Train Set, in my Mother and Father-in-laws basement. I assume that it was my father-in-laws when he was a kid, in the 1940's. I'm in the process of getting the motor reconditioned. Steve said he knew a guy (Bob) and so the little motor is on its way to Connecticut. Anyway, can anyone tell me more about this train. I read that it might have been manufactured between 1936-1940. I also have heard that some trains are considered "Pre-War' and some 'Post War'. What time period does this engine and cars belong? -Tim
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Post by dennym57 on Jul 31, 2024 14:48:57 GMT
I can tell you that it's pre-war. Post-war is after 1945. That's all I got.
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Post by josef on Jul 31, 2024 15:14:39 GMT
These Marx M1000 were released in 1935 to 1950. Its said that Marx's were running on tracks before UPs. What you have is the M-10005 which were made into late 40s still.
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Post by harborbelt70 on Jul 31, 2024 16:04:53 GMT
You'll get an answer soon enough from the true vintage experts but hasn't this model featured in another recent thread? Yours looks to me to be in fine condition.
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Post by healey36 on Jul 31, 2024 16:07:24 GMT
According to Walt Hiteshew, the silver M10005 set was manufactured in the years immediately before the war and immediately after for 4-5 years. Walt says the prewar set includes an REA car in the consist, a car that was eliminated from the postwar set. So if you have the REA car, you're looking at the late-1930s; no REA car, you've got 1946-1950 production.
The toy is modeled after the actual M10005 built by the Pullman-Standard Company in 1936 (two years after the introduction of the M10000 at the Century of Progress Chicago World's Fair). The Union Pacific's M10000 and the CB&Q's Zephyr were revolutionary in their development, construction, and service.
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Post by vintagemodeltrainguy on Jul 31, 2024 17:25:50 GMT
What is an REA Car ? Attachments:
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Post by af3020 on Jul 31, 2024 17:45:47 GMT
REA is the railway express agency - it would be a car with the markings M10005 -RPO in the catalog it was listed as REA/RPO. Your set doesn't have this car. Oh yes, RPO = Railway Post Office.
There is an interesting issue here with respect to pre/post war build. I know both Healey36 and I have a number of references. Mine is Greenberg's Guide to Marx Trains by Matzke with a publication date of 1978. According the Matzke the silver/red/blue finish of the M10005 is post war and the RPO was made both pre and post war. I know Hiteshew has made Marx trains his life study so if Healey36's reference is later than 1978 I would defer to Hiteshew with respect to RPO manufacture.
Matzke does say "The M10005 postwar version has a unique single axle motor unit in place of the usual Marx 2axle unit. Yours is a single axle so this would suggest it is a post war train set.
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Post by Country Joe on Jul 31, 2024 21:22:21 GMT
I found this photo of the REA/RPO car online.
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Post by healey36 on Jul 31, 2024 22:50:28 GMT
REA is the railway express agency - it would be a car with the markings M10005 -RPO in the catalog it was listed as REA/RPO. Your set doesn't have this car. Oh yes, RPO = Railway Post Office. There is an interesting issue here with respect to pre/post war build. I know both Healey36 and I have a number of references. Mine is Greenberg's Guide to Marx Trains by Matzke with a publication date of 1978. According the Matzke the silver/red/blue finish of the M10005 is post war and the RPO was made both pre and post war. I know Hiteshew has made Marx trains his life study so if Healey36's reference is later than 1978 I would defer to Hiteshew with respect to RPO manufacture. Matzke does say "The M10005 postwar version has a unique single axle motor unit in place of the usual Marx 2axle unit. Yours is a single axle so this would suggest it is a post war train set. af3020 I have a copy of Walt's various reference works on disc...I was fortunate to get a copy before he stopped producing them. I suspect his work went back a number of years, but I think the compilations on disc were from around 1990 or so. I don't have a copy of Greenberg's reference book, but I expect it's terrific. Some of Walt's work is available here: Marxtin
Over the years, I've found numerous discrepancies in "authoritative" references, but generally find them pretty accurate. There was so much parts swapping in manufacturing/assembly during transition periods, it's really tough to know what's what.
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Post by af3020 on Jul 31, 2024 23:42:01 GMT
Thanks Healey36. I'll take a 1990 reference over a 1978 reference any time. I didn't realize Hiteshew did a series of discs. I have his reference for the 6 1/2 inch cars which is great and has saved me more grief and buyer's remorse that I can describe. I wish I'd known about the others.
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Post by healey36 on Aug 1, 2024 11:01:06 GMT
Thanks Healey36. I'll take a 1990 reference over a 1978 reference any time. I didn't realize Hiteshew did a series of discs. I have his reference for the 6 1/2 inch cars which is great and has saved me more grief and buyer's remorse that I can describe. I wish I'd known about the others. I should clarify, af; it should read "compilation on disc", as my recollection is it was a single disc broken up into sections similar to (but not necessarily the same as) the categories on the website. I believe Mr. Hiteshew prepared each section serially over a number of years, but all were included on the single disc in some form. I have vague memories of a second Marx disc that covered repair techniques, but that might have been from a different author. I sent my copy of his compilation to a California friend and Marx collector a few years back and tried ordering another copy, but sadly the transaction never went through, presumably because the disc is no longer available. I only have a few Marx pieces (and no Streamliners). The stuff does interest me, especially their mastery of tin lithography, but it's another rabbit-hole I truly want to avoid, lol. It's interesting that Mr. Hiteshew lived in Halethorpe, Maryland, basically "across the tracks" from where my parents grew up in Arbutus. I have acquired a number of train sets from the Arbutus/Halethorpe area over the years, but no Marx stuff. The annual meet at the Arbutus Volunteer Fire Company used to be a great source for old "train garden" stuff. No idea if they still host that meet, typically held the weekend before Christmas. It would be fun to go again.
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Post by harborbelt70 on Aug 2, 2024 11:28:50 GMT
Pardon me for lowering the tone of this expert discussion but all these references to RPOs and REAs in articulated trains made me think of this example - which is a vintage classic to me because it is one of the first trains I sought out some 20 years ago on getting back into the hobby. This is Lionel's chrome-plated TMCC Burlington Zephyr, which I have had on the track lately and was reminded that the 3-car set is practically half RPO behind the cab and half REA in the middle car:
I think this set was issued in 2004 and I recall that new it was high-priced for the time at somewhere around $1K; I got mine on an auction site at a significant discount although it was practically MIB. MTH made an inferior version of this which was plastic but had a more prototypical 4-car arrangement. Lionel has done Legacy versions which have the advantage of better slow speed control, a better sound set and an extra car but simply don't match the appeal of this set's finish.
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Post by vintagemodeltrainguy on Aug 3, 2024 21:16:34 GMT
Bob Testa has the little motor, for my m10005, all fixed up. Turns out that it's probably the original electric motor. It's hard to believe it 80 years old. I'm anxious to get the motor back into the train and see the train run around the track. I'm still not sure about the original transformer. An upgrade my be in order. Anyway, I got started on a small layout table, at least compared to what I hear some of you all have built. It's all very addicting. Many of the original Marz Tin Litho Buildings are on EBay. Some are quite pricey, so I'll have to be budget friendly.
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Post by steveoncattailcreek on Aug 3, 2024 22:21:59 GMT
I'm still not sure about the original transformer. An upgrade my be in order. Well, IMHO the key to safe use of vintage transformers is to be sure the power cord (the one that plugs into the wall) is in good condition. If the insulation is cracked or broken, replace it, or have it replaced if you don't have the appropriate tools or skill set. If there's any accumulated dirt or smutz inside the case, clean it out while you have it open, and look for any signs of corrosion or broken wires. There are a few other problems that might be an issue, but barring one of the above, those little single-train transformers are pretty bulletproof IME. Good luck, and I trust Bob will have the engine back to you and running great shortly!
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Post by vintagemodeltrainguy on Aug 4, 2024 1:07:56 GMT
When I have the reconditioned motor, back in the engine, I'll be ready to test that transformer, again. IMHO, the transformer looks good and clean and the power cord looks to be in good condition. I really want to keep the set as original as possible.
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