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Post by firewood on May 1, 2024 21:24:31 GMT
I’ve been having my steam locomotive troubles lately - before my Lionel Docksider died I was working on the tender trucks from my Williams 4-6-0. It’s always been a smooth-running loco with an excellent speed range - no 200 mph. I investigated a steady squeal from the locomotive and found a wheelset on the front tender truck rubbing on the sideframe. Loosening the two screws holding the sideframes to the crossbeam, the sideframe fell apart while I was handling it. I checked the other sideframe and the simple action of rolling it between thumb and forefinger caused it to fall apart too. Checking the rear truck showed no such problem - yet… So what to do - try to order parts that might be no better? Is it the dreaded zinc-pest? Hard to say, but I’m watching closely. I decided to try making my own sideframes, just to see if I could do it. I ordered some casting silicone and cannibalized a pair of sideframes for masters. These came from an O scale AHM flatcar. Using an old cigar tin for a mold box, I cast them using JB Weld poured into the cavity left by the AHM masters. I used the Williams wheel-centre measurements to mark out the JB Weld parts and drilled them for the axles. The angle plates to mount them were made from aluminum curtain rail, drilled to match the crossbeam holes and epoxied to the new sideframes. The Williams trucks are very similar in design to Menards with two screws on each side holding the sideframes to the crossbeam. However, the Williams units are a clumsy design where the sideframes hold the axles as in other models, but the pickups are on a subframe riding on the axles. The subframe and crossbeam/sideframe assembly are not connected except at the axle riding points - a very weak feature in my humble opinion. Anyway, there seems to be some success. Both trucks are together again, and almost identical, but not quite. From three feet away they should look fine…we’ll see how they run. The photos show the crumbled frames marked in red, the new parts in yellow, and the complete rear truck in green. The side-by-side pic shows the JB Weld sideframes on the right. Dave   Attachments:
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Post by Traindiesel! on May 2, 2024 2:54:18 GMT
….The photos show the crumbled frames marked in red, the new parts in yellow, and the complete rear truck in green. The side-by-side pic shows the JB Weld sideframes on the right. Dave
I wonder if this is chronic on all the Williams 4-6-0?
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Post by firewood on May 2, 2024 3:10:04 GMT
….The photos show the crumbled frames marked in red, the new parts in yellow, and the complete rear truck in green. The side-by-side pic shows the JB Weld sideframes on the right.
I wonder if this is chronic on all the Williams 4-6-0? Good question - we’ll see how it goes I guess. Yes, a little paint touchup coming once I finish the tweaks - I might try machining up some brass bushings or just go with different trucks. I recall some reports about the Williams Peter Witt streetcars showing some pest symptoms on the trucks - that was several years ago.
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Post by Traindiesel! on May 2, 2024 3:18:47 GMT
Yes I remember reading about the Williams Peter Witt trolleys. I have one but haven’t taken it out of it box yet.
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Post by harborbelt70 on May 2, 2024 12:05:27 GMT
That is definitely zinc pest/rot. This seems to afflict all models within a manufacturer's particular model run and so I would not be in the least bit surprised if other Williams models of this type and vintage are affected.
Nice job on reconstructing the trucks. My experience is that finding exact duplicates to replace parts like these is very difficult, and you may have to put up with the closest substitutes you can find or make.
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Post by nycgeorge on May 2, 2024 12:12:12 GMT
On the Williams Peter Witt trollies. From the number of trollies I have seen - It's not a question of if but when the zinc pest strikes. Had 3 of my own trollies affected by zinc pest.
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Post by dennym57 on May 2, 2024 13:43:50 GMT
Knock on wood I have not experienced that issue so far.
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Post by firewood on May 2, 2024 14:18:42 GMT
Well, they say that to get a clear picture......you have to take a picture. Have a good look at the sideframes on the left-hand truck in the side-by-side photo. I see little cracks running the length of the sideframes - I guess the diagnosis was right, it's the pest. Looks like I'm going full replacement.
Dave
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Post by f3collector on May 2, 2024 22:47:12 GMT
Well, they say that to get a clear picture......you have to take a picture. Have a good look at the sideframes on the left-hand truck in the side-by-side photo. I see little cracks running the length of the sideframes - I guess the diagnosis was right, it's the pest. Looks like I'm going full replacement. Dave I just checked my Williams Southern Pacific 4-6-0.... Sure enough, both trucks on the tender crumbled in my hands just now. Pretty disappointed. I also have the Union Pacific and Ringling Brothers versions. Those are currently boxed up. I really don't feel like checking them out right now after seeing the SP crumble. I have a few pairs of modern Lionel roller trucks that will probably work good as replacements... I guess I'll add this to my ever-expanding to-do list.
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Post by firewood on May 3, 2024 3:43:15 GMT
I just checked my Williams Southern Pacific 4-6-0.... Sure enough, both trucks on the tender crumbled in my hands just now. Pretty disappointed. Sorry to hear that. I know how you feel - that fix-it list is a pain sometimes. I’m not sure I can find my original receipt, so I’m looking at different trucks too. Dave
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Post by firewood on May 7, 2024 2:36:39 GMT
I checked on the Bachmann Williams parts site and had a helpful email exchange with the parts dept. No sideframes in stock - besides, are all the sideframe castings affected? Upfront service fees plus shipping etc. wouldn’t make economic sense for me, so it’s truck rebuild/replacement time.
Dave
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Post by harborbelt70 on May 7, 2024 3:09:34 GMT
I checked on the Bachmann Williams parts site and had a helpful email exchange with the parts dept. No sideframes in stock - besides, are all the sideframe castings affected? Upfront service fees plus shipping etc. wouldn’t make economic sense for me, so it’s truck rebuild/replacement time. Dave
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