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Post by 4dogsinjersey on Dec 1, 2019 17:45:55 GMT
I would be curious to see a photo of the car ends....
Tom
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Post by rockymountaineer on Dec 2, 2019 22:21:50 GMT
So I called MTH this afternoon and spoke with a very pleasant, professional lady in sales who explained pretty much what we would think happens these days: namely, the factory was SUPPOSED TO build the car per the illustration, but they didn't. MTH says they really weren't aware of the issue until the cars shipped to customers, and the early customers complained. She also indicated MTH offered to take the cars back from dealers -- some shipped them back, others didn't.
Now she also clued me in to the fact that MTH made another production run of these "transitional" cars in the 2017 volume 2 catalog, and she claims those were made CORRECTLY. So we shall see. Thus far, I have been unable to locate a dealer with them in-stock, and they were only delivered about 18 months ago. So it seems they were snagged pretty quickly upon delivery by Amtrak enthusiasts. Since she seemed to have lots of copious notes on 20-68232 and 20-68233 but none on the cars from 2017v2, perhaps life is better with the follow-on cars. I can't say though, until I actually see one with my own eyes.
As for what's gonna happen with the two I purchased last week? Now that I know there are cars made correctly (according to MTH sales support), the cars I purchased are being returned back to the dealer FOR A REFUND -- not just a store credit... whether the dealer likes it or not. And if he refuses, he's gonna get a charge-back ding'ed from the credit card company. I'm just not in the mood these days of taking any crap from dealers with an attitude. And let me tell ya... this guy can have quite an attitude.
If I get around to it, I'll take a photo of the car ends... but suffice it to say, they're basically two ends of a passenger car with upper-level vestibules instead of one upper-level vestibule and one lower-level vestibule.
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Post by rockymountaineer on Dec 2, 2019 22:27:34 GMT
One further follow-up: it appears MTH has already updated the website, at least partially... to include a photo of the way the car was BUILT. I just noticed when searching the MTH website, that the photo in the search list now has two upper level vestibules. However, if you click on the 20-68232 or 20-68233 product numbers, the photo in the product detail information is still the old photo with one upper level and one lower level vestibule.
At least they acted quickly -- they just now need to follow through updating all the photos.
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Post by rockymountaineer on Dec 3, 2019 23:58:55 GMT
The saga continues.... and today was indeed a very productive day. I spoke with Rich Foster at MTH, and Rich confirmed that the "transitional" Superliner cars from the 2014 production run were made INCORRECTLY at the overseas MTH factory. HOWEVER, a subsequent production run -- catalog'd in 2017V2 and delivered in Spring 2018 -- were in fact made CORRECTLY, albeit in a very short production run, making them very difficult to locate. Indeed, the MTH Product Locator is currently showing ZERO availability of these cars. But as Rich pointed out, not every MTH dealer uses the Product Locator -- some not at all, and some don't necessarily keep the store inventory updated on the MTH end... so sometimes the Product Locator indicates inventory that doesn't really exist in a given dealer's inventory. Likewise, a given dealer may still have MTH inventory, but it's not reflected in the Product Locator. In short, it's a nice handy idea. But it's not foolproof. As an FYI to folks interested, the following MTH SKU's are CORRECTLY MADE transition/step-down SuperLiners delivered in Spring 2018: - 20-61041: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (Phase III)
- 20-61044: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (Phave IV)
- 20-61038: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (California Surfliner)
After about 12+ phone calls to MTH dealers throughout the country this afternoon, I found success at Imperial Trains here in western PA. They still had 20-61041 and 20-61044, which is really the best outcome I could have hoped for... the most recent versions of these cars made correctly (confirmed by the dealer) AND with LED lighting. YES!!!!! So sometimes we do have happy endings to challenging scenarios in this hobby. But LOTS of cycles get consumed trying to cross the finish line. Sometimes it's admittedly "fun" to chase these gems down, while other times we just wish things would get built right in the first place, which is win-win for all parties involved and helps us ALL to be more productive.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2019 0:27:59 GMT
David, your persistence paid off! Glad it worked out for you.
Andy
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2019 3:08:01 GMT
What a adventure Dave
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Post by ptc on Dec 4, 2019 12:07:53 GMT
MTH gets a lot of credit for first, telling you about the issue, and then providing a solution.
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Post by josef on Dec 4, 2019 12:15:49 GMT
That is amazing and your persistence in following leads is commendable. Thanks for sharing this with us.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2019 12:28:24 GMT
The saga continues.... and today was indeed a very productive day. I spoke with Rich Foster at MTH, and Rich confirmed that the "transitional" Superliner cars from the 2014 production run were made INCORRECTLY at the overseas MTH factory. HOWEVER, a subsequent production run -- catalog'd in 2017V2 and delivered in Spring 2018 -- were in fact made CORRECTLY, albeit in a very short production run, making them very difficult to locate. Indeed, the MTH Product Locator is currently showing ZERO availability of these cars. But as Rich pointed out, not every MTH dealer uses the Product Locator -- some not at all, and some don't necessarily keep the store inventory updated on the MTH end... so sometimes the Product Locator indicates inventory that doesn't really exist in a given dealer's inventory. Likewise, a given dealer may still have MTH inventory, but it's not reflected in the Product Locator. In short, it's a nice handy idea. But it's not foolproof. As an FYI to folks interested, the following MTH SKU's are CORRECTLY MADE transition/step-down SuperLiners delivered in Spring 2018: - 20-61041: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (Phase III)
- 20-61044: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (Phave IV)
- 20-61038: Amtrak Transitional Sleeper (California Surfliner)
After about 12+ phone calls to MTH dealers throughout the country this afternoon, I found success at Imperial Trains here in western PA. They still had 20-61041 and 20-61044, which is really the best outcome I could have hoped for... the most recent versions of these cars made correctly (confirmed by the dealer) AND with LED lighting. YES!!!!! So sometimes we do have happy endings to challenging scenarios in this hobby. But LOTS of cycles get consumed trying to cross the finish line. Sometimes it's admittedly "fun" to chase these gems down, while other times we just wish things would get built right in the first place, which is win-win for all parties involved and helps us ALL to be more productive. I was going to look for you when I went in there on Saturday. I'm glad you found them. I thought there were some Amtrak cars there but didn't know which ones.
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